Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

If you have a cactus plant and need help identifying it, this is the place to post it.
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jerrytheplater
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Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by jerrytheplater »

I have two cacti that have a label saying Pediocactus simpsonii. I know the handwriting on the label is John Spain's from CT. I purchased them at a CCSS show in the spring prior to 2017. Someone suggested they were not P. simpsonii but rather Escobaria sneedii v. leei. I'd like your opinion please.

This photo was taken June 11, 2017. Now I can say that these plants were still shrivelled and not fully expanded from the winter rest. I must not have watered them enough.
rsz_2017-6-11 Pediocactus simpsonii or Esco. sneedii v leei 2.jpg
rsz_2017-6-11 Pediocactus simpsonii or Esco. sneedii v leei 2.jpg (155.17 KiB) Viewed 518 times
I repotted my two plants on March 23, 2021 before they started growing for the season. Here they are bare root.
rsz_2021-3-23 Pediocactus simpsonii repotting.jpg
rsz_2021-3-23 Pediocactus simpsonii repotting.jpg (146.98 KiB) Viewed 518 times
Here are the two plants taken Sept 23, 2021 as they were starting to shrivel for the winter.
rsz_2021-9-23 Esco. sneedii v leei or Pedio. simpsonii 1 jpg.jpg
rsz_2021-9-23 Esco. sneedii v leei or Pedio. simpsonii 1 jpg.jpg (145.9 KiB) Viewed 518 times
rsz_2021-9-23 Esco. sneedii v leei or Pedio. simpsonii 4 jpg.jpg
rsz_2021-9-23 Esco. sneedii v leei or Pedio. simpsonii 4 jpg.jpg (145.09 KiB) Viewed 518 times
Now here is one taken on May 14, 2022 after I was more conscious of watering them in the Spring. They have flower buds just starting to show now, but maybe not in this photo.
rsz_2022-5-14 Esco. sneedii v leei or Pedio. simpsonii 1 jpg.jpg
rsz_2022-5-14 Esco. sneedii v leei or Pedio. simpsonii 1 jpg.jpg (148.14 KiB) Viewed 518 times
Jerry Smith
Bloomingdale, NJ
45 inches (114 cm) rain equivalent per year, approx. evenly spread per month
2012 USDA Hardiness Zone 6b: -5F to OF (-20C to -18C) min.
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MrXeric
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by MrXeric »

Certainly looks more like a form or variety of Escobaria sneedii (or Pelecyphora sneedii if you prefer). I believe the form/variety 'leei' has more radial spines and less central spines? Smaller too.

Easiest way to differentiate a flowering size Escobaria/Pelecyphora from other genera is to look for grooves on the tubercles. Grooves on tubercles are a defining characteristic of Pelecyphora and these grooves are not present on Pediocactus.
keith
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by keith »

Escobaria sneedii maybe v. leei not pediocactus simpsonii I have a few more seeds of pediocactus simpsonii try with thicker cardboard or padded envelope you go first :D
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by jerrytheplater »

Eric, where would these grooves be if they are there? Top?, Bottom?, Sides? Do they run around the diameter or lengthwise down it? (I just read on Llifle for E. sneedii ssp. leei that the upper surface of the tubercle is grooved on mature stems)

I'll have to get out my magnifying glass. Its going to be tough. The spines are very dense.

Llife says there is a clumping form of Pediocactus simpsonii: http://www.llifle.com/Encyclopedia/CACT ... mping_Form
Jerry Smith
Bloomingdale, NJ
45 inches (114 cm) rain equivalent per year, approx. evenly spread per month
2012 USDA Hardiness Zone 6b: -5F to OF (-20C to -18C) min.
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MrXeric
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by MrXeric »

The groove should be on the upper surface of each tubercle, extending lengthwise from where the spines are. I could not find a good picture of sneedii tubercles, but check out the images here of P. vivipara: https://www.swcoloradowildflowers.com/P ... vipara.htm
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by jerrytheplater »

Thanks Eric. The groove is very plain in that link. Now to look at mine. I'll let you all know what I find.
Jerry Smith
Bloomingdale, NJ
45 inches (114 cm) rain equivalent per year, approx. evenly spread per month
2012 USDA Hardiness Zone 6b: -5F to OF (-20C to -18C) min.
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by jerrytheplater »

I went to my copy of Britton and Rose Cactaceae to look at the entry for Pediocactus and Escobaria. Here are the descriptions published back then around 1913 or so.
B&R Cactaceae Pedio-Escobaria.jpg
B&R Cactaceae Pedio-Escobaria.jpg (142.97 KiB) Viewed 452 times
Jerry Smith
Bloomingdale, NJ
45 inches (114 cm) rain equivalent per year, approx. evenly spread per month
2012 USDA Hardiness Zone 6b: -5F to OF (-20C to -18C) min.
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by jerrytheplater »

It looks like Keith is correct. I have an Escobaria and I must have miss positioned the label. At one point these plants were growing outside in a Trough garden. The ID tag could have gotten moved by a small visitor. I could see a wooly tuft going down the upper surface of most of the tubercles. The wool was growing out of a depression on the upper surface of a Tubercle. I'll see if I can take a photo, but maybe not till next week.
Jerry Smith
Bloomingdale, NJ
45 inches (114 cm) rain equivalent per year, approx. evenly spread per month
2012 USDA Hardiness Zone 6b: -5F to OF (-20C to -18C) min.
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by jerrytheplater »

I was able to get a shot of a groove on one of the tubercles.

I first washed off the cactus with a strong spray of DI water. (It needed to be watered anyway.) I blew it off with a fine jet of compressed air to dry. Then I tried to figure out how to take the shot with the microscope at work. It took about 2 hours to prepare the cactus and position it to get the shot.
2022-5-26 E. sneedii setup.JPG
2022-5-26 E. sneedii setup.JPG (120.62 KiB) Viewed 405 times
This is an older tubercle as it has lost a lot of spines already, but that made it easier to see the groove.
2022-5-26 Escobaria sneedii grooved tubercle.jpg
2022-5-26 Escobaria sneedii grooved tubercle.jpg (115.16 KiB) Viewed 405 times
Jerry Smith
Bloomingdale, NJ
45 inches (114 cm) rain equivalent per year, approx. evenly spread per month
2012 USDA Hardiness Zone 6b: -5F to OF (-20C to -18C) min.
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MrXeric
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by MrXeric »

Nice picture.
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by Hanazono »

I have Pediocactus simpsonii v minor. My friend gave me two cacti some years ago.
They have survived but their growing speed is very slow. I have not seen their flowers yet.
The photo is one of them, just 35 mm in diameter.
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P. simpsonii v minor
P. simpsonii v minor
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keith
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by keith »

Pediocactus simpsonii all mine have started to clump which is not typical in Habitat . This is a old picture.
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Pediocactus simpsonii
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Re: Pediocactus simpsonii or Escobaria sneedii v. leei?

Post by jerrytheplater »

So this plant bloomed on 5/31. Took a photo with my new camera and a macro lens, hand held. Still learning this camera. A tripod would have helped a bit more.
2022-5-31 Escobaria sneedii.JPG
2022-5-31 Escobaria sneedii.JPG (103.33 KiB) Viewed 277 times
Jerry Smith
Bloomingdale, NJ
45 inches (114 cm) rain equivalent per year, approx. evenly spread per month
2012 USDA Hardiness Zone 6b: -5F to OF (-20C to -18C) min.
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