Is Lophophora cultivation legal in USA?

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DaveW
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Re: Is Lophophora cultivation legal in USA?

Post by DaveW »

Surprised if the Native American Church can use it other churches have not brought a case of religious discrimination that they are not allowed to?
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MrXeric
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Re: Is Lophophora cultivation legal in USA?

Post by MrXeric »

DaveW wrote: Mon Jun 13, 2022 9:05 am Surprised if the Native American Church can use it other churches have not brought a case of religious discrimination that they are not allowed to?
I looked it up and the NAC's exemption was challenged: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peyote_Wa ... Thornburgh.
The court ruled that since the NAC only accepts members with Native American ancestry, the exemption was based on a political group rather than a religious practice, so there is no case of religious discrimination. :?
There are other court cases that more or less left exemptions up to individual states, with some states allowing anyone to use peyote in the context of the Native American Church regardless of ancestry, while others, like Arizona, allow peyote use by anyone that uses it for bona fide religious or spiritual intent not necessarily in the context of the NAC.

I guess I have to move to Arizona and make a religion out of wanting to grow pretty plants if I want to grow Lophophora for cultivation purposes without of risk prosecution. :?
nes
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Re: Is Lophophora cultivation legal in USA?

Post by nes »

I knew someone that was in the native american church and did the "ceremony" on several occasions. He said that they used collected plants in their ceremonies as well. I find it disgusting.
I am told by this fellow that the NAC are bitter that natives have been searched and prosecuted in the past under suspicion or false suspicion that they were growing the special astrophytums. The plant was used as an excuse to raid native American homes from what I hear. After years of harassment for a plant that never asked to be consumed, the church grew bitter. Now that decriminalization is coming, they don't want non natives to have access to the plant because of their unfortunate history with the law.

I understand the NAC's viewpoint but fundamentally speaking, plants with mind altering chemicals shouldn't be restricted from the public in my opinion. There's no reason for it when there is so many psychoactive plants out there that are seen everywhere, at least here in California.
Examples include Jimsonweed (Datura Wrightii) or morning glories which I see growing on fences of every other house.

The NAC isn't really concerned at all about conservation. They consume a mixture of cultivated and poached plants, yet they so boldly claim to be about conservation.


In reality, if some person really wanted to try mescaline they could cultivate their own echinopsis species and use it. It grows much faster, you can't get in trouble for it, and they come in a variety of beautiful morphologies.

Besides, when will society learn to look beyond the phytochemistry of a plant for their own use and appreciate the plants psychoactive trait as an attempt to PREVENT herbivory, not encourage it.


Just an angry little rant to point out there is no real argument here. It's just human pettiness.
DaveW
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Re: Is Lophophora cultivation legal in USA?

Post by DaveW »

In Britain you can grow most things as long as you don't misuse them, apart from things like Cannabis which is I suppose our equivalent of your Lophophora ban where possession not only use in banned. Many grow Opium Poppies in their gardens as ornamentals. Though some claim our climate is not hot enough for them to be used for opium production, but some disagree.

What it all comes down to is plants only get banned in the first place if a significant proportion of the population misuses them. However if that misusing population is large enough and electorally powerful enough they are exempted, which is the reason addictive tobacco and alcohol are not already banned. However if they were introduced today they probable would have been banned as being the consumption of noxious substances. :lol:

Britain is supposedly trying to phase out tobacco products by 2030, but no doubt the tobacco firms will simply sell to E. Europe or the Third World instead. No ban on alcohol yet since I think our politicians like consuming it too much!

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/07/26/busi ... index.html
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4d3d3d3
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Re: Is Lophophora cultivation legal in USA?

Post by 4d3d3d3 »

MrXeric wrote: Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:55 am Just revisited this topic and found that there is a bill that is pending in California (SB-519) where certain hallucinogenic substances will be decriminalized, but sadly peyote (the entire Lophophora genus) is excluded and will continue to be illegal if the bill passes. The lawmakers cite its endangered status and "the special significance peyote holds in Native American spirituality".

The endangered status part is a bit silly, since it's already illegal to collect or even possess peyote in Texas, the only place in the US where this plant grows. And good luck getting Mexico to allow any cactus plant material from leaving its borders (legally anyway...) I am willing to bet the majority of Lophophora on the market today are cultivated plants from Canada, Europe, and Asia.

It seems that the Native American Church is also actively pushing against legalizing peyote/Lophophora. I believe they cite that legalization will exacerbate scarcity of this sacred plant in habitat, which is understandable, but I don't see how importing these plants from countries where it's extensively cultivated will affect the Church's ability to practice their religion.
The way it was explained to me is that legalization would result in the practice being preyed upon by capitalists, cheapening what they view as a deeply religious and sacred plant/experience. Like how magic mushrooms are or were legal in Amsterdam, and tourists would take them just to have fun and goof around. You can bet that if magic mushrooms are ever legalized or decriminalized nationwide in the US, "entrepreneurs" will take advantage and make big money on selling the "magic mushroom experience." Same fears apply to peyote. Not saying that I agree but I guess it makes sense. If I held peyote to be sacred I'd probably feel annoyed seeing it misused by people who just wanna get high and have fun.
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MrXeric
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Re: Is Lophophora cultivation legal in USA?

Post by MrXeric »

4d3d3d3 wrote: Wed Jun 15, 2022 8:56 pm The way it was explained to me is that legalization would result in the practice being preyed upon by capitalists, cheapening what they view as a deeply religious and sacred plant/experience. Like how magic mushrooms are or were legal in Amsterdam, and tourists would take them just to have fun and goof around. You can bet that if magic mushrooms are ever legalized or decriminalized nationwide in the US, "entrepreneurs" will take advantage and make big money on selling the "magic mushroom experience." Same fears apply to peyote. Not saying that I agree but I guess it makes sense. If I held peyote to be sacred I'd probably feel annoyed seeing it misused by people who just wanna get high and have fun.
It really is a more complex issue than I initially thought. On the one hand, making policy based on one group's religious beliefs rubs me the wrong way, but on the other hand a policy change would once again impact a historically marginalized group. I really there is some middle ground that could be met in this regard.
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