What to do next?

Discuss repotting, soil, lighting, fertilizing, watering, etc. in this category.
iann
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Re: What to do next?

Post by iann »

daffe wrote:
iann wrote:Suit yourself. You come asking advice from people who've actually grown cactus seedlings before, but you don't have to take it ...
sorry for stepping on your toes. BUT, if the lid is removed and replaced in lets say 1 min. how could that affect the cactus at all? Give me a good explanation please. Its not like the cactus dry up as soon the humidity is down a min ot two when the lid is off, when its back in place the humidity is high again.
Germs ;) Nothing to do with drying up, everything to do with rotting, algae, water moulds, damping off, and all the other names people have for nasties that thrive in a humid environment that a cactus has no defence against. And if you're really unlucky, fungus gnats #-o
--ian
iann
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Re: What to do next?

Post by iann »

Don't get carried away with the whole stone-eaters cult either. Makes for a nice news story, but not a practical way to grow a pot plant. Sooner or later you'll need to fertilise. With a cactus, that might well be "later", but it isn't "never". Cactus seedlings come complete with many months of nutrients built in, although they'll grow faster with a little help. Most bagged soils will include masses of nutrients, certainly enough fir a cactus for many months, 2-3 years if you really want to push it.

Your water source may also include a non-trivial quantity of nutrients. Despite what people tend to think, most municipal water supplies have significantly more nutrients than rainwater, especially nitrogen, but it varies widely. Where I live, the tapwater has enough nitrogen that I could get away with never adding more if I really wanted, although I mostly use rainwater so that's irrelevant. Rainwater rarely has more than 5ppm nitrogen and usually a lot less.
--ian
KittieKAT
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Re: What to do next?

Post by KittieKAT »

Ooh fungus gnats.....not a fun thing I've had some trapped inside sow trays that had lids on them... not an awesome germination outta that tray. But they died like all the kids sow trays did when it was vandalized...ooh well :(
DaveW
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Re: What to do next?

Post by DaveW »

Cacti in pots are not the same as the plants in open ground in habitat. There they have a large amount of soil to tap into with their extensive root system to make use of what nutrients are available. With the limited soil in a pot if we imitate habitat soils for more adult plants the nutrients would soon be exhausted, therefore we need to plant in slightly more nutrient rich potting mixtures or use weak fertilisation occasionally for more mature plants.

However cactus seedlings in habitat with their limited root system would be in nutrient poor soil, therefore obviously you need to duplicate that condition in cultivation and not fertilise too quickly since the potting soil will probably contain all they need for the first six months or so. My dad used to say when raising seedlings "you don't feed babies beefsteaks", meaning the nourishment an adult plant can take could upset or even kill a small seedling.

A quote from the following link:-

"It is a misconception that cacti actually live in true deserts where the ground is all sand. Most live in a sandy environment with very little soil, but enough for some limited nutrients to be found. Cacti are usually found in semi-desert regions and dry grasslands. One of the benefits of living in an arid region is that the cacti have no competition for the limited amount of nutrients in the ground because most other plants cannot survive in the harsh environment."

http://www.scienceiq.com/facts/cactisurvive.cfm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Too much fertiliser can kill a plant because plants take in water by osmosis where a stronger solution in the plant cells draws in a weaker solution from the soil. If you reverse this situation by making the soil water solution over strong by excess fertilisation, because fertilisers are soluble salts in one form or another, you get reverse osmosis or plasmolysis which actually draws water out of the plant and would eventually kill it:-

"A cell placed in a solution more concentrated than itself (a hypertonic solution) will shrink due to loss of water. It may eventually die of dehydration. You can observe this effect with a carrot placed in salty water. Within a few hours the carrot becomes limp and soft because its cells have shrivelled.

By contrast, a cell placed in a solution more dilute than itself (a hypotonic solution) will expand as water enters it."


http://www.scienceclarified.com/Oi-Ph/Osmosis.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.ask.com/science/plasmolysis- ... e50af04605" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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adetheproducer
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Re: What to do next?

Post by adetheproducer »

We are not a cult us Stone eaters followers Iann. Just a limited group of nutters with hard core counter culture beliefs. lol

Its just a difference of opinions and if used right there will usually be some sort of organics included in our soil mixes and we will fertilise. I think the main benefit the pure minerals mixture provide is ease of control I chose when to add organics if needed and it dries quickly in my damp and cold welsh mountain environment.
And as the walls come down and as I look in your eyes
My fear begins to fade recalling all of the times
I have died and will die.
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daffe
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Re: What to do next?

Post by daffe »

iann wrote:Don't get carried away with the whole stone-eaters cult either. Makes for a nice news story, but not a practical way to grow a pot plant. Sooner or later you'll need to fertilise. With a cactus, that might well be "later", but it isn't "never". Cactus seedlings come complete with many months of nutrients built in, although they'll grow faster with a little help. Most bagged soils will include masses of nutrients, certainly enough fir a cactus for many months, 2-3 years if you really want to push it.

Your water source may also include a non-trivial quantity of nutrients. Despite what people tend to think, most municipal water supplies have significantly more nutrients than rainwater, especially nitrogen, but it varies widely. Where I live, the tapwater has enough nitrogen that I could get away with never adding more if I really wanted, although I mostly use rainwater so that's irrelevant. Rainwater rarely has more than 5ppm nitrogen and usually a lot less.
No, i dont want to move them to only mineral "soil", but it was interesting reading. My water is from a well (180 meters down) and it has a lot of minerals in it, but i have a filter that removes lime and other things. But when i start to use my outside water faucet in the summer i think they would get almost all they need from that, or?
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adetheproducer
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Re: What to do next?

Post by adetheproducer »

Just make sure what ever mix you decide on its free draining thats the most important thing. Good luck with your growing and try not to get too addicted.
And as the walls come down and as I look in your eyes
My fear begins to fade recalling all of the times
I have died and will die.
It's all right.
I dont mind
I dont mind.
I DONT MIND
daffe
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Re: What to do next?

Post by daffe »

Her they are 4 months old. When should i move them to bigger pot? Is there any way to tell when they need water or if they get to much water?
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adetheproducer
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Re: What to do next?

Post by adetheproducer »

They still fine in the pots they are in til they about as big as your finger. Just water when soil is dry and your good.
And as the walls come down and as I look in your eyes
My fear begins to fade recalling all of the times
I have died and will die.
It's all right.
I dont mind
I dont mind.
I DONT MIND
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greenknight
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Re: What to do next?

Post by greenknight »

They're looking good! I wouldn't even worry about repotting them this year, disturbing them now would just set them back. Since they're fast growers, they might be ready to repot next Spring.
Spence :mrgreen:
daffe
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Re: What to do next?

Post by daffe »

ok, thanx :-)
iann
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Re: What to do next?

Post by iann »

No, i dont want to move them to only mineral "soil", but it was interesting reading. My water is from a well (180 meters down) and it has a lot of minerals in it, but i have a filter that removes lime and other things. But when i start to use my outside water faucet in the summer i think they would get almost all they need from that, or?
Almost certainly not. Anything that is drinkable is unlikely to contain enough nitrogen. Possibly enough for a plant to survive but not enough for it to thrive. Other minerals, who knows? Probably plenty of some, but lacking in others. No panic though, the soil will have had some nutrients and cacti can get along on stores for a long time. Just sooner or later you'll need to fertilise.

The seedlings look fine for now. Just keep going. When you can't get near the pots for spines hanging over the sides and they're in danger of breaking out of the container all on their own then you can repot. At this size they can go for periods in completely dry soil so no need to ever panic about watering. Make double sure they are dry, then drench them, then wait. You should develop an eye for when they want water and when they've had enough, but the #1 rule is always the same: if in doubt ... don't.
--ian
daffe
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Re: What to do next?

Post by daffe »

iann wrote: At this size they can go for periods in completely dry soil so no need to ever panic about watering.
Ok, how long can they go without water? Is it weeks?
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7george
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Re: What to do next?

Post by 7george »

daffe wrote:
iann wrote: At this size they can go for periods in completely dry soil so no need to ever panic about watering.
Ok, how long can they go without water? Is it weeks?
If kept at cool and shady spot this size cacti could stay several months (whole winter) dry. During the growing period even short brake (a day or so) is enough.
If your cacti mess in your job just forget about the job.
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greenknight
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Re: What to do next?

Post by greenknight »

They could easily survive weeks without water, but over-watering is likely to kill them. Wait until you judge them to be dry before you water - and then wait a little longer. As you gain more experience of how much water they use, you'll be better able to judge when they need it - but it's best to be very careful at first.
Spence :mrgreen:
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