Astrophytum asterias

[WayneByerly]

This Astrophytum asterias is looking a little shriveled. Is it lack of water? Or something even MORE sinister? There are two pictures.

I've read that Astrophytums like dry conditions, with sporadic watering in the summer and then a dry winter. So I've been a little spare on the watering process.

The second picture (labeled "2.JPG") depicts the 'condition' that i'm concerned about a little better.

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[hegar]

Hello Wayne,
I have not ever experienced a condition resembling that of your Astrophytum asterias plant. It may be caused by dessication and the plant would plump up once it receives water. However, it could also be caused by the loss of roots. That would also result in the plant becoming dehydrated.
So I would go ahead and take the cactus out of the pot and examine the roots.
You are correct with the statement you made about not watering this plant during the dormant season, especially if it is planted outside in the cactus garden. I have lost several members of this species to root rot, both during the summer months and the winter season. A. asterias is probably the most unforgiving member of that genus as far as watering is concerned. The odd thing though is, that except for Astrophytum capricorne and a hybrid of A. asterias I have lost all my Astrophytum plants over the years. Perhaps there is some truth to the statement by my former Horticulture professor, who was praising "hybrid vigor".

Harald

[keith]

Mine can look like that in the winter , one does actually and 3 don't but the three are planted deeper. I find these asterias very hard to keep alive once they get flowering size. No frost no water in winter. Good thing is they are easy from seed.

Hanzo is the master he cuts the tap roots when they are small and I've seen other strategies like shallow pots. I don't do any of that but I always keep seedlings coming on to replace my mistakes. And I use deep pots for better drainage and lots of pumice, no wood stuff ( stuff that floats ) because is it attracts scraia fly, fungus, etc.

[keith]

Winter time for A asterais

[keith]

Same cactus more of a top view. Even though its been very windy, bone dry and rather warm around here I don't water it.

Dry windy and on fire typical S CA weather

[WayneByerly]

So I would go ahead and take the cactus out of the pot and examine the roots...

Hegar
Here's a couple of pictures of the root system. I have NO idea what they SHOULD look like at 4 years old. Roots are normally a thing not seen. If anybody wishes to to impart ANY morsel of wisdom in this regard is appreciatively requested to do so.

Removed from pot, soil washed from the roots, as gently as I could (some pieces DID break off, but shown), and laid on a paper towel. And then closer close-ups as the pictures come into view.

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[stefan m.]

Yeah the roots dont look too good. Not an expert on astrophytums, but
they need be longer
and need to have carrot like tubers.
4 years old means should have (if not cut or damaged) a very thick rootball.
Only thing i could recommend you now is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=woIBKacqLYo
Id try to as much as i can to save it , its a very cute plant.
EDIT though hers wasnt very successful, your plant will probably pull through if you use a bit of root hormones.

[Hanazono]

G' morning Wayne

You said it was 4 years old.
Did you sow seed by yourself?
It seems the plant is propagated from off-set or degrafted one and rooted.

The shrinkage of body is caused by lack of water for the body.
Damaged roots and/or not enough watering make this problem.
Since we stop watering in winter, this problem is occurred quite often.
It may recover in spring when you restarted watering but some of them may not recover for ever unfortunately.

The condition of roots is not good but it is no chance to recover in your place at moment.
It will recover next spring, in March, I think.

Frank

[Steve Johnson]

If anybody wishes to to impart ANY morsel of wisdom in this regard is appreciatively requested to do so.

I may be able to help you out here. I agree with stefan m. regarding the fact that the roots of your A. asterias don't look good. At least they're not totally gone yet, so I believe you still have enough of a root system to work with. A few observations and pointers...

1. First off, the organic materials clinging to the roots of the plant are a telltale sign that your mix is too rich. While some desert cacti will tolerate it, asterias certainly won't. (Harald is correct in saying that this species is the most unforgiving of the Astrophytums.) I'd highly recommend that you lean out the mix as much as possible. That means a mix with mostly mineral (pumice is the best) and some soil with minimal organic material. I went soil-less for the vast majority of my cacti in 2012 -- nothing more than pumice and granite gravel, and you can't get any leaner than that. I acquired an asterias in July of that year, so when I moved it from terracotta to glazed ceramic 3 years later, this gave me the opportunity to see what the roots looked like. Here's what pure mineral mix can do:



2. You'll need to clean the roots of your asterias more before you repot it. If you don't, remnants of the organic stuff could be enough to cause root rot when you start watering again. Fill a container with water, then gently swish the roots around. Use a blunt instrument (q-tip handle, knitting needle, etc.) and "tease" them out as the organic remnants fall out into the water. Be sure to clean around the juncture of the base and roots. If some of the finer roots are left behind in the process, don't worry about it -- a basically healthy asterias will make more in the growing season.

3. Soak the roots in 1% Hydrogen peroxide for 15 minutes. The peroxide we get at the store is 3%, so if you dilute 1 part peroxide to 2 parts water, that'll give you the 1%. Here's an example of my setup for the peroxide treatment:



The peroxide does 2 things. First, it'll kill any pathogens that may be hanging around the roots. And second, it promotes faster healing of any root ends that were exposed due to tear-off in the unpotting/cleaning process.

4. Rinse the roots gently in running water, let them dry out, then repot in fresh, dry mix. Don't even think about watering until the next growing season begins.

There's no urgency about repotting your asterias, so prep those roots now, and keep it bare-root in a dry place until you're ready to repot at your convenience. The plant won't be doing anything until spring -- even if you're not prepared to make the jump to a soil-less aproach, at least you'll have time to investigate what different growers are using.

[WayneByerly]

Yeah the roots dont look too good. Not an expert on astrophytums, but
they need be longer and need to have carrot like tubers.

This is more for documentation of an attempt to recover the health of an Astrophytum asterias than anything else.

Stephan:
Thanks for the link. I followed it ... and several others trying to learn what to do to save this A. asterias. This is what I've done:

1. Following recommendations, I trimmed the roots to about 1/2 inch. This size was more my idea than anything else. I just didn't want to cut them back to NOTHING. If I need to later I can, but you can't put it back if you cut it too short. I then applied a root hormone and then repotted it into a shallow unfired clay bowl.

1. I used the clay bowl because it dried out FAST. I had a Haworthia obtusa in it and noticed that in order to keep it from being COMPLETELY dry for days in a row, I had to water it every third day to every other day. It is only 5" across and less than 2" deep.

Application of root hormone. I thought I took a picture of the trimmed roots, but it wasn't in the camera. So I used Microsofts MSPAINT to draw a red line through where I cut the roots.

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In its new home. I'll un-pot it in March or April, and come back to this posting to let everyone here know whether or not it survived and if it regrew its roots.

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[stefan m.]

Allright, update us if it makes it. They dont sell root hormone here, but i am intrigued by your success.

[WayneByerly]

I may be able to help you out here.

This is exactly the kind of advice that I was hoping to get when making my posting here. Possessing an A. asterias yourself, you may be able to understand how desirous I am of saving this Cactus. I've had it for 4 years, and it is one of my favorites. To have it die on me now would almost be more than I could bear. I'm really quite attached to this little cactus. Please be assured Steve that I will follow your advice assiduously. I'll keep track of the names of all the members that have responded to this posting so that I may keep you up-to-date as to what happened with it come springtime.

The roots on YOUR A. asterias are about as awesome as they get. Thanks for the picture. I will aspire to such prolific a set of roots ... and definately will switch to a much greater percentage of inorganic soil as you suggest ... especially if the results YOU have gotten are attributable to such a soil admixture.

SO many "experts" seem to think that all cacti should be grown in the same medium and watered in the same fashion and given the same bright light conditions. I have learned in the last couple of years that this is not so, and so solicit the opinions of the true experts here at this forum.

thanks for your input.

[WayneByerly]

You said it was 4 years old. Did you sow seed by yourself?

No, I bought it from an Internet cacti shop when it was about 25-30mm or so wide. You may have read elsewhere on this page of my appreciation for the input from what I considered to be the true experts on cacti care here at this forum. I very much appreciate your taking time from your day to help me with my request for information.

[WayneByerly]

I'd highly recommend that you lean out the mix as much as possible.

How about this stuff... Nothing organic, readily available from Amazon...
https://www.amazon.com/Bonsai-Soil-Mix- ... +amendment

Or maybe this stuff with very little organic content?
https://www.amazon.com/Quarts-Bonsai-Su ... onsai+jack

[hegar]

Hello Wayne,
most likely both mixes would be fine with cacti. However, for me to purchase them would be way too expensive. I am fortunate enough to go to the nearby mountains and just take a few buckets of the grainy material present in the arroyos. Arroyos are temporary creeks, which form after rains in the desert and dry out quickly, i.e. they do have very good drainage. At least our native cacti do thrive in that kind of soil, which contains quite a bit of gravel (mostly limestone).
There are other good artificial "soil mixes" that you could produce yourself for possibly a lot less money. Some do include Perlite, pumice, and even cat litter. The information is present here on the homepage of CactiGuide when you click on the tab "Growing Cacti" at the top of the page and additional suggestions are made if you were to click on the tab "Growing Help" here above the text I am writing now. After that you will find a tab named "Cultivation" and there toward the top are various "recipes" for creating your own growing medium.
The homepage advice section also does spell out the difference in "jungle cacti" and "desert cacti". Because these plants do naturally occur under different growing conditions, their needs are also not the same.
I am growing an Epiphyllum sp. cactus in the desert cactus soil and it does fine thus far. I do need to water that plant a little more than a desert cactus and I also apply a bit more fertilizer to it to make up for the different requirement this plant has. Almost all my other cacti are of the desert variety. I do apply Miracle Grow 15-30-15 plant food several times during the growing season until late summer/early fall at 1/3 to 1/2 the recommended rate, in order to help the plants out with their nutritional needs and also acidify the irrigation water with vinegar, due to our alkaline tap water.

Harald