Pronouncing Scientific Names

[Kattatonic]

Being new to the cacti and succulent community, i was surprised that the majority of enthusiasts use the scientific names for their plants.
I'm slowly learning names and species.

I was wondering if any one had any tips or bare basics to learning these scientific names, and pronouncing them.

Are there any prefixes or suffixes that identify a certain characteristic of a plant?
What are your favorite family names?

Hope to get to know you all and become an active member!

-Katt

[DaveW]

Afraid I never learnt Latin so this is simply what I picked up through growing cacti for 50 years therefore no doubt somebody may correct me.

W. T. Stearn, in his book "Botanical Latin" suggests Botanical Latin is a written language never really intended to be spoken, but to verbally communicate we have to attempt it. Therefore botanical names tend to be pronounced as a combination of how classical scholars would pronounce them (even though classical scholars can never know how the Romans pronounced Latin since there were no voice recorders then), plus how your own language would pronounce those letters. As long as we are understood it does not really matter. He also said that botanical and medical Latin have now become languages of their own, becoming more and more divorced from classical Latin.

Really from a hobbyists point of view it is more important you know your plants universal Latin name than how to pronounce it, since you will write it more than probably speak it. The problem with popular names for plants is they are usually country specific, or even area specific, so are meaningless outside of that area and are even confusing. For instance, a Scottish bluebell is not the same genus let alone species as an English bluebell, or even a French one, but the Latin names of all three are different therefore definitely identify them.

As a guide see:-

http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/Pronunciation.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.finegardening.com/pronunciation-guide/a" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As to prefixes and suffixes, these do often convey some information. As you would expect "pseudo" as a prefix indicates false and "neo" = new. So Pseudolobivia meant "false Lobivia", given when somebody decided to section it off into a new genus, just as Neoporteria meant "new Porteria" because somebody tried to try and name a cactus genus Porteria not realising the name existed in another family of plants which is not allowed, therefore had to dream up a new name for it by adding "Neo" in front.

As to suffixes, generally plants named after men end in i or ii (= laui, weinbergii etc) , whereas those after women in ae (= saboae). Those after places or countries often have ensis added (= chilensis, hidalgensis) but this does not always apply.

The convention for writing Latin botanical names is ranks of genus or above are always written with a capital letter (= Cereus, Mammillaria etc), whereas subgeneric names are always written with a small or lower case letter (Mammillaria elongata, Cerus peruvianus, Neoporteria wagenknechtii etc) even if the subspecific or varietal name is named after a person or place.

Under the old American Code, long ago scrapped in favour of the International Code, subspecific names were capitalised if named after a person or place (Cereus Peruvianus after Peru or Neoporteria Wagenknechtii named after Rodolfo Wagenknecht) and you may still find them written this way in old books. However the International Code decided this was misleading since if somebody just wrote "Peruvianus" it could be mistaken for a genus, whereas "peruvianus" would not.

To be absolutely correct and according to the "rules" all botanical names ought to be underlined if being typed or hand written (= Cereus peruvianus since that is the printers signal in a manuscript to render it in italics when setting up the type for printing), or if being printed and in these days of word processors rendered in italics (= Cereus peruvianus). However generally speaking on labels and when generally writing them on forums we don't bother, but should still use the small letter rule for names beneath the rank of species. But if you are a member of a cactus society and get a journal you will usually note all the plant names are in italics to conform to "the rules".

[Kattatonic]

Dave!

This was beyond helpful! Thank you so very much for sharing your knowledge.
You have a fine point about most often writing the names as opposed to speaking them. You answered my question with an abundance of knowledge.
I feel so much more informed about what i'm learning now. Who knew that botanical Latin was even a thing.

Thanks again, you're helping a new enthusiast get a start on the right foot.

[DaveW]

One other rough rule in Latin I was told Katt is that "CH" is pronounced as a "K" and "PH" as an "F". The story I was told is when the Romans imported words from Greek (botanical names although said to be Latin are often a mixture of Greek and Latin) as they had no letter for the "K" or "P" sound they made them up by using "CH" and "PH". Unfortunately they later adopted the K and P but did not change the words again. We still have this anomaly in English hanging over from the Romans since we still spell Christmas with a CH and not a K for Kristmas, which would be more logical and Philip with a PH instead of logically an F for Fillip!

However we do not always know how to apply it with names from other languages, particularly peoples names. Do you pronounce the letters in the Latin form or as the person would? In the UK Echevaria usually gets pronounced as Ek-ee-Varia, the Latin form, whereas the gentleman it was named after would probably pronounce his name more like Esh-ee-var-ee-a. As said, as long as we all understand each other it really does not matter. If you are in a cactus club though you will usually find "group speak" emerges, where all tend to pronounce things the same. However move to another area and you may find they pronounce some things differently.

If you really want to bore yourself to death, read the International Code here, which few of us ever do since it's hardly bed time reading. I must confess I give up after a few minutes!

http://www.iapt-taxon.org/nomen/main.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Kattatonic]

Dave,

The Ch pronounced as a K sound was briefly highlighted in one of the links. It's a sound i quite like in my mouth compared to the CH sound. However i'm already starting to feel the regional pronunciation in myself. Since i live in an area where Spanish is spoken often, the CH is much more natural to me.
Though i enjoy exercising the use of the K sound, i think it's a useful tip to become comfortable in trying to pronounce a wide range of names.
I already feel like a botanist!

I have the pleasure of driving by many different cacti and succulents on my drive home, and i'm having such fun trying to remember and speak all the names.

[DaveW]

I found out when I went to Chile Katt after going to Spain in the past that you on the American continent speak Latin Spanish as opposed to Castilian Spanish in Spain, which is what is usually taught in the UK. I never learnt Spanish therefore tried to learn a few words before I went, but it did not stick at my age, old dog new tricks etc. Luckily some in the group spoke Spanish and we were out in habitat most of the time, therefore at dinner I only needed Pollo, Papas Fritas and Fanta and stuck to that. Well I like chicken and chips (or French fries as you Americans call them) and being TT I like orange and Fanta seems to be universal there!

I also found they did not use the "Spanish lisp" in S. America:-

"Take for example the word gracias – in Latin America, along with a sizable part of Southern Spain and the Canary Islands, the word is pronounced grasyas.

In most of Spain however, it’s pronounced “grathyas” – following the rule of distinction, the c is pronounced th."

http://www.fluentu.com/spanish/blog/dif ... n-spanish/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I had to get used to a few place names though which as far as I could pronounce them in phonetic English were as below, the double L being an English Y:-

Ovalle = Oh-vay-ay

Vallenar = Vay-an-are

Olmue = Olm-way

Anyway that got me by, and I though Latin was hard!

[Kattatonic]

Dave,

I really enjoyed your perspective findings on Latin vs Castilian Spanish.
It makes a lot more scene to me now why Hispanics in my area identify as "Latinos."

Luckily for me the Y sound for double L's (ll) comes naturally. Certainly glad i paid at least some attention in High school Spanish now!

I had the pleasure of visiting a nursery for the first time yesterday, and had quite a great time seeing the cacti and succulents and being able to confidently say some names, as well as share information with my boyfriend. He was quite impressed at what i'd learned in such a short time.

I find myself trying to say a name two or three different ways to find what way sounds best to me.

[DaveW]

You may find Cactus Mall useful for finding nurseries (online or to visit) or seedsmen:-

http://www.cactus-mall.com/apps/california.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.cactus-mall.com/nursery.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.cactus-mall.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;