Lithops help

[shaunamcg]

I posted this on another forum last week where some wonderful people seemed to think everything is alright with my plant. I'm still unsure of what's going on so I thought I'd ask for a second opinion.

Beware this is a long post!

I am a little confused by one of my lithops.

I got it a little over a year ago from a reputable local-ish cacti and succulent nursery; I've gotten many plants from them over the years and never had a problem. It was grown a little softer than I like but otherwise seemed healthy.

Soon after I got it, it (and all my other lithops) regenerated. However, unlike the others, the new growth didn't come through the top, but rather came through the side and was wearing the old leaves like a hat. The old leaves fell off soon after.

I read about lithops doing that sometimes, usually due to overwatering.

The new growth was much much smaller than the old and it was harder. It wasn't fleshy like other lithops, but felt more like a hard rubber ball. It also didn't have a transparent window on the top. It was also wrinkly. I gave it extra water last spring and summer, but no amount of water made the wrinkles go away.

I was a little weirded out by this, but decided to see what would happen. Well nothing has happened! It has been EXACTLY the same for 12 months! It doesn't plump up with water and it doesn't get any more wrinkly without water. It didn't flower and it isn't regenerating. All my other lithops are in the process of regenerating, but this little dude is staying his same old hard, wrinkled, window-less self.

It spent april-october outside in full all day sun. And spent late october-now indoors in front of a south facing window that when the sun is out gets 6 hours of direct sun. It has not received any water since October; however our place runs fairly humid in the winter and I usually have to worry about my lithops being too fat even without water all winter.

I pulled him out of his pot and checked the roots. He was very firmly in there with a long tap root and loads of small feeder roots. The roots seem dry, but I'm not sure how dry they should be for this time of the year. I actually don't know if I could tell dead roots from live ones!

No signs of life for 12 months makes think he's dead.

But if he was dead wouldn't I be able to tell? I've killed a handful of lithops before and they've never look exactly the same for a year!

I've also never seen a lithops so small, hard, and without a transparent window.

Thanks for reading and any thoughts you have would be great!

[iann]

It isn't dead Everything you describe is normal enough. Far too early to worry about not seeing new growth this year. If there is nothing in another month then perhaps time to think it is skipping a year, but still not dead. Maybe it will die, but it isn't there yet. Plant it, give it a few weeks, then try watering again.

[shaunamcg]

Hi Iann!

Thank you so much for your reply.
I've seen some of your other posts and you have such a lovely collection and a wealth of knowledge and experience

He's been back in his pot for about a week; I'll give him at least another week before I give him any water. I'll probably wait until the end of the month to water

Could this be a vascular problem? Maybe the roots aren't functioning optimally (or at all).

I've only been growing mesembs for 3 years or so, so I've still got so much to learn! I'm not too worried about loosing this guy, it's definitely a learning experience for me.

[KittieKAT]

I had a lithops that had wrinkles like that it was changing skins, and it was thirsty but I made it wait like the other one I had it was fine in the end

[shaunamcg]

Thought I'd give an update just in case anyone winds up searching these forums with a similar problem:

Been watering it WAY more than I ever thought I should be. Decided that worst case I would loose the plant which is no big deal.

The plant has perked up and now looks more like the others. It has grown more than twice it's size since I posted this question and looks all around healthy now (better colour etc). Still no signs of new growth however. Thinking it's too late in the year.

I'm realizing that I've been seriously under watering all my plants. Living in wet BC Canada has made me deathly afraid of overwatering, but I think it's been at the expensive of the health of my plants I've killed more airplants than I can count from lack of water! I'm watering 3-4 times more now than I was last year and all my plants seem to love it. Growth spurts all around.

My mix is extremely fast draining and I wasn't allowing the mix to stay wet for long enough when I did give my plants their infrequent waterings.

This was my only lithops in tera cotta (he's now in plastic like the rest) which I think was the reason it was different than the rest.

Anyway, I'm loving learning how to properly keep these little guys alive even though I feel terrible for keeping them dehydrated for so long

[C And D]

I think more Lithops are killed by under watering than overwatering

People think they can survive on dry air alone for some reason, or a tablespoon every other month

I give mine plenty of water during their seasonal growth period, and just watch them to see if they are too plump, just right, or too lean, and then water accordingly.

And when you water, soak the pot to get the water to the bottom roots.
A lean soil mix is very important for Lithops, so they don't blow up after watering.


By Fall, they should be nice and plump for the flowering season.

[K.W.]

I think more Lithops are killed by under watering than overwatering

People think they can survive on dry air alone for some reason, or a tablespoon every other month

I give mine plenty of water during their seasonal growth period, and just watch them to see if they are too plump, just right, or too lean, and then water accordingly.

And when you water, soak the pot to get the water to the bottom roots.
A lean soil mix is very important for Lithops, so they don't blow up after watering.


By Fall, they should be nice and plump for the flowering season.

Good morning Craig,

you're talking to me from the heart!
Everywhere I read, Lithops can not dry up - just rot. I think since a long time that this is nonsense.
In their habitat they get every morning dew - and in our greenhouses?
I do it like you, not too little water. It is important to watch the plants.
It is similar with Conophytum and Ariocarpus, the plants are often in the water for weeks. In Habitat!
But in the collections they are watered three times a year.

Best wishes

K.W.

[iann]

They won't dry up if you water them three times a year Not with a teaspoon of course. I'm not even sure how you guys are drying up your Lithops. I have one that hasn't had roots for 18 months, It looks pretty awful but it isn't dead. A couple of heads I took off have rooted, which I think is telling me something ...

[K.W.]

They won't dry up if you water them three times a year Not with a teaspoon of course. I'm not even sure how you guys are drying up your Lithops. I have one that hasn't had roots for 18 months, It looks pretty awful but it isn't dead. >>>

I had a grandmother, she looked terrible, but not dead. But is that the way to take care of his grandmother?

<<< A couple of heads I took off have rooted, which I think is telling me something ...

We need water!!!!!!!



K.W.

[iann]

Yes, very funny, but I suspect deliberately missing the point.

Let's try and put some useful information out there instead of claiming Lithops either need "a lot of water" or "not a lot", neither of which mean anything. Do they need more or less than most cacti? I would say less, certainly less *often* although a substantial drink each time,at least for their size. Don't water them with a teaspoon or pipette, don't water them more often than once every few weeks, and make absolutely sure that your watering system doesn't cause stacking. Anyone that gives you precise quantities or timings is an idiot because they don't live where you live, and probably have no clue about your growing conditions. One variation to consider is that large clumps need considerably more water than a single or double head; fairly obvious if you think of 10-20 heads in a pot not so much bigger than one or two (but also ultimately a problem as the roots just don't develop proportionally to the number of heads).

In northern Europe, what works well is leaving them entirely dry from winter until the old leaves dry up (at least mostly) in spring, then watering well (once, twice, three times, as much as it takes) until the new leaves become fully developed, then less often during summer, deeply again in autumn to support flowering but not so much (or so often) that the plants stretch badly in the low light or become so bloated that they won't dry out the old leaves in spring.

[shaunamcg]

Thank you everyone for your replies!

I was shocked at how much water it took to get this lithops looking healthy again; I was convinced that it would turn into a rotten mess right away. It must have been seriously dehydrated. It was pale and sickly coloured, now it's bright and vibrant.

then watering well (once, twice, three times, as much as it takes) until the new leaves become fully developed,

That was something that I was not doing with any of my lithops! When the new leaves emerged I held off on watering for a while thinking they didn't need it. I don't think that the leaves ever fully developed after they emerged.

There is always something more to learn! Thank goodness for people like you all

[C And D]

Me and Ian always disagree on watering advice

But in the end, the disagreement is good advice

Ian lives in England, I live in Southern California, others live in Tucson or Texas
and others live in Alaska, or Michigan...
and everyone has different growing conditions, soil, and pot style.

BUT!!!!!
But if Ian tells us he waters "about every 3 weeks"
and Craig tells us he waters "about every 1 to 2 weeks"
and someone in Texas says he waters "about every week"

Then you can feel informed that watering every month is not enough
and you need to water more

Ian's growing conditions are less than optimal in comparison to mine, so he has to be extra cautious with watering, he has learned from long experience what works in such a dismal climate, and you have to be very careful and observant to grow at his expert level

For me
I have to water way more than someone down the street using a richer soil
But I have learned for me to grow at the expert level I need a lean soil and frequent waterings of about every week for plants in growth when warm. I go up to 14 days in the winter. But of coarse they get no water or water once a month in the off season.

I've heard so many people telling me that they only water once a month or less, and they think that the plants grow better when kept dry for some reason. That may be OK for large pots, but small pots dry out way faster.

when I was a novice, the fact that some people were watering every week or more was an important learning lesson, and after growing so much from seed, which need water every 1-3 days, you learn that these plants need water, and going dry for too long may have a detrimental effect on root health.

This is more of general advice for general succulent culture, not just Lithops, which should be kept dryer than most other succulents. A Lithops could live for a year or 2 with no water, but it won't be happy.

You have to come up with your own watering plan, and hopefully you can decide what's best for your plants after learning from expert growers from all around the world.