Yellow Sedum? #2

[Dalesmicro]

I think this is also a sedum. Stems up to 50 cm long, leaves 2 X 1.5cm, flowers 1cm diameter. Thanks again for your input!

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[greenknight]

An Aichryson, maybe?

[Rosemarie]

Possibly Sedum oreganum. (If it were Aichryson, there would be more petals.)

[greenknight]

Good point about the petals, I neglected to count them.

Rather broad leaves for S. oreganum - but then, I've never seen it as a potted plant, only on a ridgetop at 5.000 ft elevation.

[Dalesmicro]

Thanks for the input on this plant. As I have said in other posts, one of my goals is to take whatever pictures are necessary for identification and perhaps now is a good time to ask for input on what structures are important. Are there structures I need to photograph that would help with the identification?
I have spent many hours on line looking at pictures of yellow flowered sedums and found one that might be a possibility (based on my very limited knowledge). It seems also have strongly pared leaves with successive pairs that are at right angles to each other (decussate?) and petals that are flat rather than keeled like a boat. Is Sedum obcordatum (a species from the Pico Orizaba in Veracruz) a possibility?
Like S. oreganum this plant seems to be cold hardy as it sometimes drops below freezing on winter nights and we haven’t seen any damage.

[greenknight]

I wasn't familiar with Sedum obcordatum, but in all the pictures I can find it has even broader, thinner leaves, and the flowers don't open wide.

I wouldn't necessarily eliminate S. oreganum; searching a bit more, I found Sedum oreganum ssp. tenue, with leaves very similar to your plant's. On the other hand, the leaves seem to be alternate rather than opposite, but it does show there's considerable variation in the species.

S. oreganum has a characteristic of turning to a burgundy color in the Autumn, has this one shown any sign of that?

[Dalesmicro]

I wasn't familiar with Sedum obcordatum, but in all the pictures I can find it has even broader, thinner leaves...

I did notice the relative thinness of the S. obcordatum leaves, and to me most of the leaves of S. oreganum seem more succulent than my plant. I wondered how much leaf thickness is related to the state of hydration of the plant. My plant was probably near its maximum state of hydreation as I had washed and watered the plant the day before I took the pictures. Only four days have passed since then and many of the leaves, especially the younger ones, already appear to be thinning. I will wait a week or so and take new pictures.

... and the flowers don't open wide.

I noticed that too. It seems unlikely that everyone took pictures before the flowers had a chance to completly open. Indeed the variability among pictured plants seems minimal. I wonder if many, or perhaps even all of the plants in cultivation are clones from one plant or collection and don't really show the variability present in most natural populations.

I wouldn't necessarily eliminate S. oreganum; searching a bit more, I found Sedum oreganum ssp. tenue, with leaves very similar to your plant's.

I agree the the general shape is close but the width to length ratio seems pretty narrow, and acording to the information on the sedumphotos.net page on the subspecies, these plants are tiny only reaching a height of 1 inch.

... On the other hand, the leaves seem to be alternate rather than opposite, but it does show there's considerable variation in the species.

Does anyone have or is growing S. oreganum with leaves that are as strongly opposite in the rosets as in my plant?

... S. oreganum has a characteristic of turning to a burgundy color in the Autumn, has this one shown any sign of that?

We have had this plant for several years and any reddening seems to be limited to leaf edges, and mainly those of dying leaves where the plant has removed the chlorophyll componenets leaving the anthocyanins, etc.(similar to the origin of the colors in autum leaves).

A new piece in the picture:
Yesterday I took a cutting of my plant to a flower market in Xochimilco hoping to find the plant for sale or someone who could identify it. I was unsuccessful, but bought a book: "Las Crasulaceas de Mexico" by Gorge Meyean Garcia (2003) In this book he refers to some 20 sections that the Sedum genus has been divided into. Because the flower stalks are axial my plant appears to belong to section 11, the Pachysedum section. There is a small subsection 11B, the Palmeri subsection that is characterized by flowal spikes that initially seem to be terminal, but because the leaf axes continues to grow, become axial. As the following pictures show, my plant is part of that group which includes the Mexican species S. burrito, S. morganianum, S. obcordatum, S. torulosum, S. compressum, and S. palmeri.

Can anyone provide information on which section S. oreganum is in or if the flower stalks are terminal or axial?

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[greenknight]

Here's another page I looked at: Oregon Stonecrop: Sedum oreganum (Synonyms: Gormania oregana, Sedum oreganum ssp. oreganum, Sedum oreganum ssp. tenue) . I missed if before, but it says there that the flowering stems have alternate leaves. A picture there of a more broad-leaved specimen, too, looks as if it may have been growing in shade. Another source I found says the red color appears when they're grown in full sun. How much sun does your plant get?

More good pictures here: CalPhotos - including one that shows the position of the flower stalk very nicely.

Your last pictures do look more like S. obcordatum. As for the flowers not fully opening, I saw that not just in photos, but in a botanist's drawings of its identifying characteristics. Still doesn't prove the trait can't vary, of course.

Telling these creeping sedums apart is not easy.